On his namesake page [PYK] made the following offer to the community in response to a comment by [APN]: : "As I've said before, I'm willing to take my efforts to my own website, if people really would rather I do that." So, lets take a polling of the community consensus of the community's desire to take [PYK] up on his offer. Therefore, the question of this vote: Should [PYK] "take [[his]] efforts to [[his]] own website" and leave the Tcler's wiki alone?" '''Note: At this point, everyone in the community has already formed an opinion of [PYK] and his editing of the wiki. This page is not meant to be a place for debate nor a place for pleas attempting to sway opinions in one direction or another. It is merely meant to collect the votes of the community members to the question above.''' Please edit the page and place your vote below the appropriate section heading below: ---- ** Vote YES: I would like [PYK] to "take [[his]] efforts to [[his]] own website" and leave the Tcl'ers wiki alone: ** [RLE]: I vote YES. [PL]: I vote YES. [Anonymous]: I vote YES. ---- ** Vote NO: I would like [PYK] to continue to edit the Tcl'ers wiki: ** [aprendiz]: I vote NO. [MS]: I vote NO [Kroc]: I vote NO [SEH]: NO [JJM]: I vote NO. [bll]: I vote NO. [MDD]: NO. ---- ** Discussion ** [dbohdan] 2015-12-31: The implicit assumption made above is that such matters can and should be decided by popular vote. Personally, I find it far from obvious why this is the case. It is especially questionable to call for a vote right after an attempt to resolve the conflict through violence (use of bots to coerce the other party to give up). I think what the wiki needs is, ultimately, a bit more of hands-on governance. That would first and foremost include rules for conflict resolution and someone to act as an arbiter who has the final word. (1) Then everyone who agrees to abide by the rules can stay and everyone who disagrees can fork the wiki or otherwise go and post elsewhere. (1) Now, ''that'' I would vote on (even though I'd rather see that person chosen by consensus). [MS] 2015-12-31: I like to believe that I am part of this community, have not formed an opinion, and would like to understand [RLE]'s real beef with [PYK] - in this page, or in another one linked from here. From the description at [PYK]'s page, I tend to believe that [RLE] is the one who has broken the house rules by removing pages wholesale ... with a robot??? Phrases like "do ... and it [[your page]] can stay" also show that [RLE] has a sense of ownership that is completely misplaced. Maybe it is [RLE] who should open "Curated Tcler's Wiki, by RLE", where he can insure his conditions are always met. That being said: * I do not think we should EVER ask ANYBODY to leave this wiki. * I strongly dislike PYK's 'space before a comma' style [Kroc] 2015-12-31: I completely agree with MS. [octavsly] 2015-12-31: @PYK @RLE: grow up and learn to listen. both of you. [APN] 2015-12-31: I'm unwilling to even dignify this page with a comment. And am unhappy about being mentioned out of context in the first line of this page. The point of my original comment was that a lot of what PYK writes would in my view be expressed more cogently on its own without editing existing pages and annoying others. I admit that instead of saying "on your own blog" (or whatever it was that I said) I should have said "on its own page" maybe even on this wiki. Certainly I wouldn't want PYK to leave and even if I wanted it so, I would certainly not think I have the right to opine that about _anyone_. [bll] 2015-12-31: I voted no, but I agree with APN, I also find this page rude. It is not my place to say what PYK does. I will leave the choice to PYK. [jrapdx] 2015-12-31: It's hard to understand "kicking someone out" or off these pages. Isn't it supposed to be a shared resource and responsibility? Respecting contributions and avoiding intrusive editing would seem basic to the situation. I concur with the opinions of APN and bll, and endorse the idea of having "polarizing" content on isolated pages. Over many years I've found this wiki to be enormously useful and definitely prefer it remain open, friendly and highly informative. [CliC] Wow...just wow. Kicking someone off this island over punctuation? Is it adversely affecting wiki functionality? I'm mostly a lurker, but one thing I always liked about this site was the civility. IMHO I wouldn't generally change someone else's content (if that is what's happening), but barring threats of violence or something I can't justify banishing someone. Maybe I'm not seeing the larger picture? [dzach] I too find this page rude, but took the time and read most of the long arguments on [PYK]'s profile page. To my opinion, [AMG]'s position there consolidates what I believe is the essence of the existence of this wiki and the reason why most of us visit it and contribute views and code. Also, in those same discussions one can find reasons that explain, to a certain point, [RLE]'s reaction to [PYK]'s effort to make the wiki conform to a certain style that he favors. Having said that, I believe that the issue here is not whether [PYK] should be expelled from the wiki, which is indeed wrong, but whether he should refrain from changing other peoples writings and code or not. To that question I vote YES: Please leave other people's style and code as the they wanted it and, please, do comment on anything you find wrong of improper. Self righteousness is a negative attitude and most people have difficulty to tolerate it.